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	<title>Comments on: Farewell, Editor &amp; Publisher (We all knew this day would come)</title>
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	<link>http://steveouting.com/2009/12/10/farewell-editor-publisher-we-all-knew-this-day-would-come/</link>
	<description>Journalist, consultant, entrepreneur ... Musings on digital media, Web 2.0/3.0, &#38; news in the Internet era</description>
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		<title>By: Twitter Journalism &#187; How News Of Editor &#38; Publisher Shutting Down Spread On Twitter</title>
		<link>http://steveouting.com/2009/12/10/farewell-editor-publisher-we-all-knew-this-day-would-come/comment-page-1/#comment-58960</link>
		<dc:creator>Twitter Journalism &#187; How News Of Editor &#38; Publisher Shutting Down Spread On Twitter</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 17 Jan 2010 05:01:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://steveouting.com/?p=1063#comment-58960</guid>
		<description>[...] Steve Outing: Farewell, Editor &amp; Publisher (We all knew this day would come)  [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Steve Outing: Farewell, Editor &amp; Publisher (We all knew this day would come)  [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Tom Johnson</title>
		<link>http://steveouting.com/2009/12/10/farewell-editor-publisher-we-all-knew-this-day-would-come/comment-page-1/#comment-51716</link>
		<dc:creator>Tom Johnson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 14 Dec 2009 18:45:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://steveouting.com/?p=1063#comment-51716</guid>
		<description>What will happen to the E&amp;P Yearbook, both the archived data and who will pick up the banner to collect that data in the future?
-tj</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>What will happen to the E&amp;P Yearbook, both the archived data and who will pick up the banner to collect that data in the future?<br />
-tj</p>
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		<title>By: Steve Outing</title>
		<link>http://steveouting.com/2009/12/10/farewell-editor-publisher-we-all-knew-this-day-would-come/comment-page-1/#comment-51715</link>
		<dc:creator>Steve Outing</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 14 Dec 2009 18:32:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://steveouting.com/?p=1063#comment-51715</guid>
		<description>Apologies for being slow to respond to the comments on this item! ...

DBH: As a (physically distant) contractor and not an employee of E&amp;P/Nielsen, I probably have a different perspective. I don&#039;t know that the E&amp;P brand will live on necessarily, because there are so many other online venues that do a good job of tracking news-industry news and trends. I say this in part because I really thought the Rocky Mountain News brand would live on in some way in Denver. But while owner Scripps gave the archives to the Denver Public Library, at this point I still don&#039;t think the brand name has been released by the company, even though it supposedly was on the market. (I know because I tried to get it for a higher-ed project.) Guess they&#039;d rather see it die than someone else carry it on and maybe not live up to the quality of the brand when it was alive. That makes me feel less than confident that E&amp;P will live on in some way. (Though I hope it does.)

Roger: A trade magazine model is very different indeed than for a newspaper in the digital age. I did not advise them on their model, and would have wanted to see E&amp;P do things differently than it did (and felt that way for a long time). They *had a pay-wall model*, but it was with older content; you had to be a member to search the archives for my older columns, for example. You also paid if you wanted the monthly print magazine. Had they put their current web news behind a pay-wall, I don&#039;t think it would have worked well because of the competition from other free sources. Nieman Media Lab, for example, does a great job covering the news and media space on the digital side; had E&amp;P locked down its newest coverage, outfits like that would have taken advantage and grabbed a bunch of E&amp;P traffic. Ditto for Poynter.org, which could have stepped in to cover newspapers more broadly and not just focus on digital as with Nieman&#039;s blog. And of course Romenesko had a big impact, I believe; E&amp;P should have hired him long ago when he was shopping his media blog around.

So no, I don&#039;t think they followed my advice. If they had, there would be a strong community on the site and every article would have at least had comment threads; they&#039;d have had more blogs earlier; they&#039;d have created premium web and mobile services that offered better value and a better experience (including perhaps communities limited to paying subscribers) rather than try to charge for content that&#039;s not unique. They&#039;d be the top aggregator/curator of newspaper-industry news.

Personally, I think the deck was simply stacked against E&amp;P. I&#039;m not the first to say that they operated in a troubled industry (magazines) reporting on an industry in serious decline (newspapers). Just as with many newspapers, I don&#039;t get the sense that Nielsen gave them enough resources to develop a forward strategy. (E.g., they were burdened by a corporate CMS that wouldn&#039;t even allow them to have comments on articles! I complained about that for many years and multiple editors before Mitchell.) That&#039;s why I wasn&#039;t surprised at the news of Nielsen&#039;s decision to kill it.

Bruce: Protecting the newspaper is fine by me, as long as you&#039;re also planning and building for the digital future. Your strategy sounds like it could work short-term, but what then when advertiser and audience behavior has flipped in your market? (Admittedly I don&#039;t know much about your specific market.) I advocate for planning and building for the future that we know is coming -- some places sooner than others.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Apologies for being slow to respond to the comments on this item! &#8230;</p>
<p>DBH: As a (physically distant) contractor and not an employee of E&#038;P/Nielsen, I probably have a different perspective. I don&#8217;t know that the E&#038;P brand will live on necessarily, because there are so many other online venues that do a good job of tracking news-industry news and trends. I say this in part because I really thought the Rocky Mountain News brand would live on in some way in Denver. But while owner Scripps gave the archives to the Denver Public Library, at this point I still don&#8217;t think the brand name has been released by the company, even though it supposedly was on the market. (I know because I tried to get it for a higher-ed project.) Guess they&#8217;d rather see it die than someone else carry it on and maybe not live up to the quality of the brand when it was alive. That makes me feel less than confident that E&#038;P will live on in some way. (Though I hope it does.)</p>
<p>Roger: A trade magazine model is very different indeed than for a newspaper in the digital age. I did not advise them on their model, and would have wanted to see E&#038;P do things differently than it did (and felt that way for a long time). They *had a pay-wall model*, but it was with older content; you had to be a member to search the archives for my older columns, for example. You also paid if you wanted the monthly print magazine. Had they put their current web news behind a pay-wall, I don&#8217;t think it would have worked well because of the competition from other free sources. Nieman Media Lab, for example, does a great job covering the news and media space on the digital side; had E&#038;P locked down its newest coverage, outfits like that would have taken advantage and grabbed a bunch of E&#038;P traffic. Ditto for Poynter.org, which could have stepped in to cover newspapers more broadly and not just focus on digital as with Nieman&#8217;s blog. And of course Romenesko had a big impact, I believe; E&#038;P should have hired him long ago when he was shopping his media blog around.</p>
<p>So no, I don&#8217;t think they followed my advice. If they had, there would be a strong community on the site and every article would have at least had comment threads; they&#8217;d have had more blogs earlier; they&#8217;d have created premium web and mobile services that offered better value and a better experience (including perhaps communities limited to paying subscribers) rather than try to charge for content that&#8217;s not unique. They&#8217;d be the top aggregator/curator of newspaper-industry news.</p>
<p>Personally, I think the deck was simply stacked against E&#038;P. I&#8217;m not the first to say that they operated in a troubled industry (magazines) reporting on an industry in serious decline (newspapers). Just as with many newspapers, I don&#8217;t get the sense that Nielsen gave them enough resources to develop a forward strategy. (E.g., they were burdened by a corporate CMS that wouldn&#8217;t even allow them to have comments on articles! I complained about that for many years and multiple editors before Mitchell.) That&#8217;s why I wasn&#8217;t surprised at the news of Nielsen&#8217;s decision to kill it.</p>
<p>Bruce: Protecting the newspaper is fine by me, as long as you&#8217;re also planning and building for the digital future. Your strategy sounds like it could work short-term, but what then when advertiser and audience behavior has flipped in your market? (Admittedly I don&#8217;t know much about your specific market.) I advocate for planning and building for the future that we know is coming &#8212; some places sooner than others.</p>
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		<title>By: This week in media musings: RIP E&#38;P, and Google&#8217;s and Rosen&#8217;s story ideas &#124; Mark Coddington</title>
		<link>http://steveouting.com/2009/12/10/farewell-editor-publisher-we-all-knew-this-day-would-come/comment-page-1/#comment-51701</link>
		<dc:creator>This week in media musings: RIP E&#38;P, and Google&#8217;s and Rosen&#8217;s story ideas &#124; Mark Coddington</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 14 Dec 2009 17:09:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://steveouting.com/?p=1063#comment-51701</guid>
		<description>[...] few went deeper, though, on what E&amp;P stood for and what killed it. Longtime E&amp;P columnist Steve Outing reflected on the newspaper industry&#8217;s resistance to change, adding that &#8220;I let the newspaper [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] few went deeper, though, on what E&amp;P stood for and what killed it. Longtime E&amp;P columnist Steve Outing reflected on the newspaper industry&#8217;s resistance to change, adding that &#8220;I let the newspaper [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Editor &#38; Publisher to close, news surges on Twitter &#124; Twitter Journalism</title>
		<link>http://steveouting.com/2009/12/10/farewell-editor-publisher-we-all-knew-this-day-would-come/comment-page-1/#comment-51454</link>
		<dc:creator>Editor &#38; Publisher to close, news surges on Twitter &#124; Twitter Journalism</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 13 Dec 2009 15:46:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://steveouting.com/?p=1063#comment-51454</guid>
		<description>[...] Steve Outing: Farewell, Editor &amp; Publisher (We all knew this day would come)  [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Steve Outing: Farewell, Editor &amp; Publisher (We all knew this day would come)  [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Allan Hoving</title>
		<link>http://steveouting.com/2009/12/10/farewell-editor-publisher-we-all-knew-this-day-would-come/comment-page-1/#comment-51427</link>
		<dc:creator>Allan Hoving</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 13 Dec 2009 12:21:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://steveouting.com/?p=1063#comment-51427</guid>
		<description>Or E&amp;P could have actually helped pioneer a viable method of online monetization (like, oh, i don&#039;t know... maybe... PayCheckr.com)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Or E&amp;P could have actually helped pioneer a viable method of online monetization (like, oh, i don&#8217;t know&#8230; maybe&#8230; PayCheckr.com)</p>
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		<title>By: Mike Peterson</title>
		<link>http://steveouting.com/2009/12/10/farewell-editor-publisher-we-all-knew-this-day-would-come/comment-page-1/#comment-51326</link>
		<dc:creator>Mike Peterson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 13 Dec 2009 01:02:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://steveouting.com/?p=1063#comment-51326</guid>
		<description>I&#039;ve respected your work, Steve. You don&#039;t get into the Jeff Jarvis mode of &quot;It&#039;ll be groovy and we&#039;ll all live in domes&quot; cosmic idealism. But it&#039;s inexcusable for a trade journal like E&amp;P to fail, while another trade journal, the Wall Street Journal, has made the online/print thing work for them. I think there has been considerable mission drift under Greg Mitchell, not in a liberal/conservative mode but in the slant towards the newsroom at the expense of circ, advertising and production coverage. I agree to some extent with Roger in that there is a question of why you should buy the cow when the milk is free, but I also think more and more segments of the paper found their interests minimized while the newsroom segment of the magazine swelled. I would also suggest that a better on-line product -- starting with comments at each article and email addresses for contacting the authors -- would have changed the tone of &quot;do we want to keep paying for all these subscriptions?&quot; around the conference table. If I&#039;m in the pressroom or advertising, my answer is, &quot;I can live without it.&quot; And you can&#039;t succeed if your target audience doesn&#039;t need you.

As noted on my own blog, E&amp;P could have retreated behind the same pay wall that protects the WSJ -- but only by remaining vital. Which, I&#039;m sorry to say, it did not manage to do.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;ve respected your work, Steve. You don&#8217;t get into the Jeff Jarvis mode of &#8220;It&#8217;ll be groovy and we&#8217;ll all live in domes&#8221; cosmic idealism. But it&#8217;s inexcusable for a trade journal like E&amp;P to fail, while another trade journal, the Wall Street Journal, has made the online/print thing work for them. I think there has been considerable mission drift under Greg Mitchell, not in a liberal/conservative mode but in the slant towards the newsroom at the expense of circ, advertising and production coverage. I agree to some extent with Roger in that there is a question of why you should buy the cow when the milk is free, but I also think more and more segments of the paper found their interests minimized while the newsroom segment of the magazine swelled. I would also suggest that a better on-line product &#8212; starting with comments at each article and email addresses for contacting the authors &#8212; would have changed the tone of &#8220;do we want to keep paying for all these subscriptions?&#8221; around the conference table. If I&#8217;m in the pressroom or advertising, my answer is, &#8220;I can live without it.&#8221; And you can&#8217;t succeed if your target audience doesn&#8217;t need you.</p>
<p>As noted on my own blog, E&amp;P could have retreated behind the same pay wall that protects the WSJ &#8212; but only by remaining vital. Which, I&#8217;m sorry to say, it did not manage to do.</p>
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		<title>By: Bruce Wood</title>
		<link>http://steveouting.com/2009/12/10/farewell-editor-publisher-we-all-knew-this-day-would-come/comment-page-1/#comment-51109</link>
		<dc:creator>Bruce Wood</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 12 Dec 2009 02:26:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://steveouting.com/?p=1063#comment-51109</guid>
		<description>I&#039;m sorry to read of E&amp;P&#039;s folding. I&#039;m surprised it didn&#039;t go quarterly instead. 
While I don&#039;t believe newspapers should continue to do things the way they&#039;ve always done them, I&#039;m more inclined to agree with Roger when it comes to paying for news on the web. 
While we&#039;re only a weekly, we&#039;ve flipped the usual format and deliver the newspaper for free in the target market area and just recently started charging for online access. Since it&#039;s the printed newspaper that generates the lion&#039;s share of our revenue, it makes no sense to spend dollars chasing the nickels of online revenue.
According to independent surveys, our newspaper readership has held steady over the past four years at over 60% of adults naming us as their number one source for local news.
And while you&#039;re correct to claim that we&#039;re &quot;protecting&quot; the printed newspaper, why shouldn&#039;t we? That&#039;s what is paying the salaries of the reporters writing the news. 
Since readers are price sensitive, let them read the printed paper for free and pay for the electronic version with all its bells and whistles.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;m sorry to read of E&amp;P&#8217;s folding. I&#8217;m surprised it didn&#8217;t go quarterly instead.<br />
While I don&#8217;t believe newspapers should continue to do things the way they&#8217;ve always done them, I&#8217;m more inclined to agree with Roger when it comes to paying for news on the web.<br />
While we&#8217;re only a weekly, we&#8217;ve flipped the usual format and deliver the newspaper for free in the target market area and just recently started charging for online access. Since it&#8217;s the printed newspaper that generates the lion&#8217;s share of our revenue, it makes no sense to spend dollars chasing the nickels of online revenue.<br />
According to independent surveys, our newspaper readership has held steady over the past four years at over 60% of adults naming us as their number one source for local news.<br />
And while you&#8217;re correct to claim that we&#8217;re &#8220;protecting&#8221; the printed newspaper, why shouldn&#8217;t we? That&#8217;s what is paying the salaries of the reporters writing the news.<br />
Since readers are price sensitive, let them read the printed paper for free and pay for the electronic version with all its bells and whistles.</p>
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		<title>By: Roger Plothow</title>
		<link>http://steveouting.com/2009/12/10/farewell-editor-publisher-we-all-knew-this-day-would-come/comment-page-1/#comment-51002</link>
		<dc:creator>Roger Plothow</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 11 Dec 2009 16:07:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://steveouting.com/?p=1063#comment-51002</guid>
		<description>My I humbly submit, Steve, that the sad demise of E&amp;P is yet another example of why you&#039;re wrong. Didn&#039;t they essentially follow your proposed model of free access, unique content and advertising? And yet, it failed. 

As a friend of mine (an ad director in Texas) noted, he used to be a faithful subscriber to E&amp;P until they provided it for free. How many thousand times did that scenario play out?

Your loyal opposition,

Roger Plothow
Editor and Publisher
Post Register
Idaho Falls, Idaho</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>My I humbly submit, Steve, that the sad demise of E&amp;P is yet another example of why you&#8217;re wrong. Didn&#8217;t they essentially follow your proposed model of free access, unique content and advertising? And yet, it failed. </p>
<p>As a friend of mine (an ad director in Texas) noted, he used to be a faithful subscriber to E&amp;P until they provided it for free. How many thousand times did that scenario play out?</p>
<p>Your loyal opposition,</p>
<p>Roger Plothow<br />
Editor and Publisher<br />
Post Register<br />
Idaho Falls, Idaho</p>
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		<title>By: Editor &#38; Publisher Folds After 125 Years &#124; WNBTv - will not be televised</title>
		<link>http://steveouting.com/2009/12/10/farewell-editor-publisher-we-all-knew-this-day-would-come/comment-page-1/#comment-50918</link>
		<dc:creator>Editor &#38; Publisher Folds After 125 Years &#124; WNBTv - will not be televised</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 11 Dec 2009 03:21:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://steveouting.com/?p=1063#comment-50918</guid>
		<description>[...] Outing pens his own [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Outing pens his own [...]</p>
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